Regarding Economy, Villages and war

[Kokeshen]

Ninja, I definitely agree that there should be more than 12 resources in game. To be honest, I should have said 1 MAIN resource per village because of course a player would need many minor resources to create different items in any profession. I think i didnt mention this cause i wanted to get to the other stuff 😂 my bad.

But running from your input on Monopolies i can agree that it would make diplomacy between villages stiff. So perhaps instead of outright monopolies, Villages might have an overwhelming natural supply of resources than others. This would encourage war a bit more yet still restrict them into peace with a village just for all the amount of Steel they may need. I dunno i think it could work.

As for Chakra natures I was thinking what mamita said before as to how the Chakra natures would be done. Thought the Shinobi Life Online Hidden Villages thread was dated, as I could have sworn that i read somewhere on here that those chakra natures were more of a guideline.

Anyway even if we were mistaken I think Chakra Specific Professions is the way to go.

       1) Because it adds another layer of trade between Villages. For example, If The Village Hidden by Dust had a Chakra Infusion Profession with wind release. Well then they might be allied to The Village Hidden by Metal in order to fix the market. After all, what's a weapon without Chakra Infusion?

These would make relationships almost neccessary between certain Villages. I think this is awesome because what if some Evil Org plots to take a Village because of their specific Resource/Profession therby disrupting the entire world! Or perhaps making them war each other, I mean I think players could really get creative with this. Maybe Orgs pop up to DEFEND against this threat.

       2) Villages would actively seek out Shinobi from other villages with professions that their village needs. This adds to Kage's responsibilities and I think really ups the Kages importance in game. Lets just say the Kage from The Village Hidden by Snow really needs a weaponsmith in their village, well he could send emissaries to seek them out in other villages(More shinobi Job creation 😄) and perhaps decrease the tax on weaponsmith businesses to be almost non-existent. This Plus the Kages trade agreements with other villages for differing weaponsmith ingredients could make The Village Hidden by Snow a Haven for Buisnessmiths instead of The Village Hidden by Metal.

Yeah in The Village Hidden by Metal you could make your weapons for near nothing (If you farm iron) but that Kage might have trade agreements with other villages that make the other smaller ingredients expensive. That coupled with the fact that everyone there is a blacksmith makes it hard for you to sell it to the Kage for a price that is worth it to you. So why not go to The Village Hidden by Snow for awhile make some weapons sell it for a good price and stack $$ lol.

Heck in order to keep this going in The Village Hidden by Snow their Kage might only allow 5 weaponsmiths to set up shop. what if you and 1 other person are the only ones to take the bait. Well its race to buy buisnesses than in The Village Hidden by Snow! Weaponsmith empire anyone??

        3) It requires players to go out into the world and explore other villages instead of Staying in One village most of the time. Lets say you want a crazy infused weapon but you live in The Village Hidden by Shock Waves and your kinda poor. The ones in your Village cost too much because they aren't interested in the weapons trade and doesn't have much of a variety.(Other villages would make weapons their priority making villages who don't have those abundant resources not interested in making weapons as the primary source of cash).

Well, then you as a player can take it upon yourself to head to The Village Hidden by Metal to get a cheap but really good sword there. Then you travel to The Village Hidden by Dust for tons of variety of infusions for cheap and BOOM you got yourself a really good weapon in your price range.

Merchant players could even do that and make lets say The Village Hidden by Hills an exchange or something where all the merchants go to sell their wares. Because they might have the least amount of reasources or something. So even lazy players who may not want to do that could go to the exchange in the Hidden Hill to buy whatever they want.

[NinjaMirage]

I absolutely agree with the resorses only being available in logical places. If your looking for a poisones salt water fish like puffers you would not look in a lake. However somthing like iron that needs to be mined from the earth might work better to have a spawn % based on the areas. Example
Mountains 80% chance
Hills 60%
Desserts 50%
Forests 40%
Islands 20%

[mamita]

Personally, I think that restricting players to two starting natures
by their choice of village isn't the way to go.
Say I had a player who wanted to start as a Kazangakure shinobi
who used water. They should be free to make that choice.
It also doesn't seem realistic.

Although I understand that those two natures are supposed
to be what you inherit from your parents when you're born,
it doesn't seem likely that the village's required natures for combination
would be the only possible natures present.

Say that the aforementioned player doesn't just not care about the combination jutsu,
he outright wants to become a water master instead, and he's chosen Kazangakure
because he likes the location and people. (And a 2.5% chance of getting that combination
jutsu seems like a foolish thing to aim for anyway.) Given that this game is about
being your own shinobi, you should be free to start however you want.

Ultimately I think that the dated system will be changed in time to reflect this.

[StriderOtaku]

Personally, I think that restricting players to two starting natures
by their choice of village isn't the way to go.
Say I had a player who wanted to start as a Kazangakure shinobi
who used water. They should be free to make that choice.
It also doesn't seem realistic.

Although I understand that those two natures are supposed
to be what you inherit from your parents when you're born,
it doesn't seem likely that the village's required natures for combination
would be the only possible natures present.

Say that the aforementioned player doesn't just not care about the combination jutsu,
he outright wants to become a water master instead, and he's chosen Kazangakure
because he likes the location and people. (And a 2.5% chance of getting that combination
jutsu seems like a foolish thing to aim for anyway.) Given that this game is about
being your own shinobi, you should be free to start however you want.

Ultimately I think that the dated system will be changed in time to reflect this.

@Vreg There's seems to be a bit of confusion here. Please, some clarification would be nice, thank you.

[NinjaMirage]

If you can give me one example of someone that choose there nature other then orochimaru did for yamito, then i will agree that you should be able to choose your natures. The way we have it now is the most true to the naruto universe we can make it and still give players a choice.

The natures of the village give you 100% chance to get 1 of the 2 natures you want.

If you want water and lightning but you want lightning the most then go to a village with a lightning nature. You then have a 25% chance of getting the water nature later. Now Maybe there could be mission threads that increase the probability of getting water nature. Or some way of training the nature that you want if you have not inherited the village legacy.

But in the  scenario above you have an equal chance to get fire wind and earth as your second nature even if your in a village with out those natures.

Only 2 natures is important because it will force teamwork even among rouge to players.

But this is way natures cannot be tied to a carrier. It dose not make any sence. Chakra natures don't even exist until you use a jutsu requiring a change in nature. Why would they effect a persons choice of carriers?

[mamita]

Touche. I apologize for my rudeness.
I came off kind of like a know-it-all.

Say I had a player who wanted to start as a Kazangakure shinobi
who used water. They should be free to make that choice. This is actually a real player.

It just doesn't seem realistic that there would be only two natures in a village.
I suppose you're right though...

Also, sorry if I seem ignorant, but what are you referring to when you say "Carrier"?

[NinjaMirage]

 Career I mean!! Sorry for the mis spell.
Blacksmith
Medical nin
Poison master
Stuff like that.

And again every village will have natures other then there 2 legacy just 1/4 as many as the 2 the village legacy will have.

[Kokeshen]

I mean I get what Vreg was thinking when he was coming up with Chakra Natures and their links to villages. I like his system the more I think about it. Only thing that might be off about it is that the Hidden Hill Village will undoubtedly be the most populated by far. Best solution I can think up with for that is to make it so players can change citizenship to other villages later in game.

I stand by the Chakra specific careers tho because as a player 1 Chakra nature is picked b4 you even log into the game. So this adds another element to picking your first Chakra nature. Also, this can lead to certain professions not having many people, which can be good for the few people that are in the profession, meaning in certain servers there will be an Ultra elite.

[NinjaMirage]

I think your overly hung up on gear. @Kokeshen
Why should there be ultra elite anything??
This game is about skill and teamwork not leveling and gearing up. Careers only need to be available to help drive the economy. And chakra natures don't have much to do with that.
So why complicate something that takes a way from the focus of the game.

And I'm still alittle fuzzy on why chakra natures should make better items anyway??

Using chakra with a weapon makes it more effective.
So
Using chakra to make the weapon makes it even more effective??

Why would iron or steal hold fire chakra used to make it??

[Kokeshen]

Look Ninja, if this game is gunna work then it needs to be self-sufficient. Meaning missions pop up based on player made needs. if everyone's a Village shinobi then the only missions will be trade and stuff between villages.

Its a good crutch but I don't think that's nearly enough.

Furthermore, if everyone anywhere can be any profession then it will be easy for there to be an oversaturated market for everything. Which would make players less rich in turn leaving less money to pay other players for missions.

Now if this were to work then players who make large amounts of money will no doubt do it over and over again until they are Ultra Rich. This is good for the economy because Ultra rich people spend their money on more stuff, more jobs etc.. You get the idea the wheel keeps turning.

The thing is that the game needs to drive these players to want to be ultra rich otherwise this system won't work. What's the point of having a million dollars in a game if everything cost 10$ right?

I'm not hung up on gear either. I just know there will be gear in game.

Thats why I was using it as an example to explain my idea. In reality, if Vreg makes the game dependent on player strategy (Which is the feeling I get from reading his posts) Then gear and items will only be the cherries on top so to speak.(And I like that 😄)

Ohh and Chakra Infusion is just my take on a potential career. It's based off enchanting from other games, except that instead of boosting stats it would MAYBE give the user a special (Albeit minor) Jutsu. Also just because my hypothetical Chakra Nature to work in that profession is wind, it doesn't mean it would make the Jutsu's exclusively wind type. Same goes for other professions.

Also wanna clear up that weapons wouldn't have fire natures in them. What I meant was simply that Fire nature Shinobi are the only ones to take on the Blacksmithing profession. That they would be given another jutsu tree for blacksmithing. And those jutsu's would be used in farming/creating the items. But the weapons themselves will just be regular old weapons.

[NinjaMirage]

I am not typing to be combative here!
I think you should search the forum for discussion on fuinjutsu for your enchantment ideas.

It literally is sealing chakra in items and weapons!! And will be in the game!!

But that is a skill tree all by itself!!

I still see no reason to make Careers chakra bound. The same number of players would have careers if they got to choose there careers as if it's chakra bound - "saturation" as you say is will be worse if it's chakra bound because the majority of players will be Shinobi and will pick
 Offense of chakra types.

Trickle down economics doesn't work in real life what makes you think it will work in game??

What happens when the few rich people go off line or stop playing the game??

Isn't it better to let players spend there time making poison or weapons or whatever they want

And let the economic value of the items be driven by difficulty to obtain the materials...
no one will get obsessive wealthy with this system but the will always have a way to get what the need to keep supporting there cause... whatever that may be
Villages
Clans
Orgs

[Kokeshen]

Really? I didnt know that was Fuinjutsu lol 😂.  Im gunna check it out.

But I don't think there would be the same amount of people choosing careers. The main reason to make it Chakra bound is that people have to pick between the Nature they want and the career they want. Its Roleplaying for sure but with a purpose.

Otherwise your making a game reminiscent to WoW. Where players change careers on a whim. Where you have to farm for hours (Or even days) in order to gather enough resources to sell for a reasonable amount of $$. Cause everyones gunna be doing it.

Ohh and I wasn't thinking that the rich players were gunna be helping the Middle - Lower class gain wealth. Because that is what Trickle down economics is. I was just saying that as a fact if you had wealthy players that they will make jobs for sure. Now whether that helps the Lower classes make enough money to become wealthy is completely different.

[NinjaMirage]

No one is suggesting that changing careers is an option. As in real life most people pic a career and spend there life mastering it.

Remember that there will be server sponserd missions not offers by players, also can send gennin out to gather resources for you as well.

Careers should just be a supplement to you income or make the items you use the most

There are 3 major parts to this game that will take time.
Fighting
Farming resources
And
Training

If you want to make money spending your time farming is a good way to do it. But you won't be training and the. Will need to pay people to go get higher quality resources that you can't get because you don't have the skills to reach it or servive the area it's found in.

Or you train and get hired to go get them.
And make your money that way. If we have the resources set up as king of hill style play areas the more skilled you are the more resorses you can clam. Then people will seek you out and pay you to get resorses for them because you will be able to gather them faster for them and your self.

[HermitTheSage]

I never replied to this because people went on hype with their essesys, but I think people agree about have resources scattered around the map for villages to war over.

Did people agree to these resources being represented as scrolls that are taken back to their village? I don't know. But think of about it. Like this you can destroy building that offer services, for example, you can destroy their local Mars ramen essentially cutting off their food supply for a while. Or a black smith.
What I'm saying war would be fun, attacking villages sounds nice, destroying building makes feel like you some hoarde sweeping by and taking their resources. It adds salt on war and gives it a better taste. Plus a real motive to fight for your village. War becomes more Patriotic

[NinjaMirage]

I am not sure if distraction of buildings will be possible??? Last I heard they would not be. But
Stealing resources from a village... that idea I like. But not finished items like ramen.
The eggs, rice, salt, soy, and meat that make the ramen yes I'm down with stealing these things. But finished crafted items that you sell should not be lootable unless it's from a died body.

Going to war for resorses should and will likely be a major reason for war. Sence we can all agree that resorses should be logically placed in villages controlled areas. I.e. Sulfur should only be found near volcanoes, wood in forests, fish in water, ext.